Theoben

[cookiesdaughtersdad]

I want to shoot rabbits and squirrels and pigeons as well ideally, so maybe a tripod type affair is what I need?

I've got a Wembley tempest hand held thing but that's just for arsing about with and is probably laughed it in the gun world!

Not squidgers as well Ben next you will be saying magpies
Dont know much about using guns but in my limited experience I wonder if a silencer would help as what I saw some years ago, they could fecking react quickly to the sound
I know the legal power of an unlicensed air rifle is 12 ft/lbs, a gun with a bit more, producing pellet speeds closer to supersonic, would get them before they could react to the noise.
Firing a few "blanks" when the the birds are out of rang will scare them and/or make them more used to the noise and so easier to shoot.
I think Kevs idea of a drying out log would be good as well, narrow the shot distance.
The best thing to keep the birds off the water is human presence and simply clapping the hands will feck em right off.
Killing a few will have limited effect in my opinion but one less is one less eh.
The only thing I would wish to try and guarantee is a clean kill and so only shoot when conditions such as distance are ideal

Cheers Alan

[Barryfisher]

[quote


I know the legal power of an unlicensed air rifle is 12 ft/lbs, a gun with a bit more, producing pellet speeds closer to supersonic, would get them before they could react to the noise.


Cheers Alan[/quote]

It would also get him a mandatory five years jail sentence if caught

[Mike J]

Hi Ben,
Ive managed rivers and lakes and also controlled cormorants.

Lets start from the beginning
You say your Club has appointed you as a Bailiff, yet you refer the the Police as filth.
A good working relationship with your local Police is essential if you ever have trouble with lawbreakers during your bailiffing duties, so you attitude towards our law enforcement agencies will need to be readjusted pdq.

The most common places the birds choose to dry out are usually beyond air rifle range.
They can be ambushed when they surface after a dive but the bird is swimming which makes the head ian almost impossible target to hit with a rifle.

Killing any living thing isnt "a party" and shouldn't be referred to as such, not unless your wish is to provide ammunition for the antis who WILL be watching for the slightest indiscretion on your behalf when they realise that you or others are culling the birds.

Your club must hold a valid licence to cull cormorants, on the licence it will state the number allowed to be culled and it will not be many, it could be as low as 5.
Your reference to a "party" suggests you may not be the only 'legally authorised person' culling the birds?
If the culling is being observed by non members you and whoever else is doing it will need to liase regulary inorder to ensure your Club does not exceed its cull quota. If the quota is exceeded the licence may not be renewed and/or you could find your Club being prosecuted by one of the bird/animal protection societies.

Hope this helps.

[cookiesdaughtersdad]

[quote


I know the legal power of an unlicensed air rifle is 12 ft/lbs, a gun with a bit more, producing pellet speeds closer to supersonic, would get them before they could react to the noise.


Cheers Alan

It would also get him a mandatory five years jail sentence if caught [/quote]

Where did I suggest he used an unlicensed fire arm, all I said was a more powerful weapon would be more effective

Hi Ben,
Ive managed rivers and lakes and also controlled cormorants.

Lets start from the beginning
You say your Club has appointed you as a Bailiff, yet you refer the the Police as filth.
A good working relationship with your local Police is essential if you ever have trouble with lawbreakers during your bailiffing duties, so you attitude towards our law enforcement agencies will need to be readjusted pdq.

The most common places the birds choose to dry out are usually beyond air rifle range.
They can be ambushed when they surface after a dive but the bird is swimming which makes the head ian almost impossible target to hit with a rifle.

Killing any living thing isnt "a party" and shouldn't be referred to as such, not unless your wish is to provide ammunition for the antis who WILL be watching for the slightest indiscretion on your behalf when they realise that you or others are culling the birds.

Your club must hold a valid licence to cull cormorants, on the licence it will state the number allowed to be culled and it will not be many, it could be as low as 5.
Your reference to a "party" suggests you may not be the only 'legally authorised person' culling the birds?
If the culling is being observed by non members you and whoever else is doing it will need to liase regulary inorder to ensure your Club does not exceed its cull quota. If the quota is exceeded the licence may not be renewed and/or you could find your Club being prosecuted by one of the bird/animal protection societies.

Hope this helps.

I wait for reply that will surely be pdq

Hope this helps

Cheers Alan

[Barryfisher]

Alan, Ben has already clearly stated above that he doesn't want the expense involved in getting a firearms certificate and he doesn't want, to quote Ben, "the filth" turning up to check that his gun cabinet is adequate and adequately secured to the floor/walls..........

Since these are essential requirements to obtain a firearms licence, perhaps you can explain how else he could use an air gun with "a bit more power than the legal unlicensed limit of 12 ft.lbs" other than using an unlicensed one?

[Barryfisher]

all I said was a more powerful weapon would be more effective

Cheers Alan

Alan, all I would say is that's what I call stating the bloody obvious!

I hope you didn't have to google that

[cookiesdaughtersdad]

all I said was a more powerful weapon would be more effective

Cheers Alan

Alan, all I would say is that's what I call stating the bloody obvious!

I hope you didn't have to google that

Not always, ever heard the expression of "having to much gun", we are not talking about increasing the size of the round, just its velocity.
I did just google Barryfisher and got two answers, one was https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Fisher the other was http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=knobhead

Cheers Alan

[Barryfisher]

Alan,
It just shows how wrong you can be when you rely on Google, since both of those answers don't apply to me. However, the Australian cricketer may very well have been a knob head, just like you can be at times :laughs

[Edward.P.A.C]

I did just google Barryfisher and got two answers, one was https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Fisher the other was http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=knobhead

Cheers Alan

Is it just me, or is there a pattern forming here

the one common denominator always seems to be you Alan...

[cookiesdaughtersdad]

Alan,
It just shows how wrong you can be when you rely on Google, since both of those answers don't apply to me. However, the Australian cricketer may very well have been a knob head, just like you can be at times :laughs

You may be surprised that if ever I was fortunate to meet you that you would realize that I don't carry a laptop up my shirt to be able to give informed replys, no matter what some may have you think
In simple terms my suggestion to Ben of using a more appropriate weapon for the task may well be worth the extra fuss of getting a firearms liscence
Here is a question for you Barry, I know a chap who got caught having several guns including shotguns and rifles and many thousands of rounds without a license, he was persecuted and went to crown court, what was his punishment?

I did just google Barryfisher and got two answers, one was https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barry_Fisher the other was http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=knobhead

Cheers Alan

Is it just me, or is there a pattern forming here

the one common denominator always seems to be you Alan...

With people like you it does Edward and I worry about the fixation you now have with me you are either trolling me or you have heard about my pert but not so little bottom

Cheers Alanb

[AndyFrost]

[quote="cookiesdaughtersdad"]
Here is a question for you Barry, I know a chap who got caught having several guns including shotguns and rifles and many thousands of rounds without a license, he was persecuted and went to crown court, what was his punishment?



Cheers Alanb

Meeting you Alan

Andy.

[Barryfisher]

Alan, quite frankly, I don't know nor do I care to know what happened to him, but I hope that he was prosecuted and not persecuted as you stated

Whatever happened to him, there still remains in UK law, a mandatory minimum five years imprisonment for using an unlicensed firearm........

It's of no concern to me if Ben wants to shoot as many cormorants as he likes, using a licensed firearm or not. However, he asked Pit members for advice and as a licenced shotgun holder, having experience of using pneumatic precharged air-rifles and being a past fishing Club Chairman and Secretary involved with dealing with mink and cormorants, I felt somewhat qualified to offer some advice.

Unlike some people, I do not profess to know everything about everything. I'm like Grant, in that I know a bit about a lot of stuff and a lot about a bit of stuff. Having a Master of Science degree (with Distinction) I've probably forgotten more about science than you've ever googled and spouted out on here as your own knowledge.......

I'm quite sure that, if we were to meet sometime, we would probably get on well, with our common interest in wildlife etc. However, in the time that I've been a member of the Pit, it's been painfully obvious that googled responses form a large part of your posts. Why else do you think you get so much banter about it?
Therefore, I was surprised that you took offence about my bit of banter about you googling something, sufficient to call me a knobhead! Is that really the true spirit of a moderator?

However, I'm thick skinned and I've been called worse that that before, so it's water off a ducks back to me as I'm a firm believer in that if you can't take it you shouldn't dish it out.

I also think that all of the points made in Mike J's post above, that you highlighted, were excellently made and full of common sense advice for someone like Ben in his newly appointed role as a Bailiff.

The last thing that any of us on here would wish would be to give the anti's any more ammunition (no pun intended) than they already have

[Barryfisher]

Hi Ben,
Ive managed rivers and lakes and also controlled cormorants.

Lets start from the beginning
You say your Club has appointed you as a Bailiff, yet you refer the the Police as filth.
A good working relationship with your local Police is essential if you ever have trouble with lawbreakers during your bailiffing duties, so you attitude towards our law enforcement agencies will need to be readjusted pdq.

The most common places the birds choose to dry out are usually beyond air rifle range.
They can be ambushed when they surface after a dive but the bird is swimming which makes the head ian almost impossible target to hit with a rifle.

Killing any living thing isnt "a party" and shouldn't be referred to as such, not unless your wish is to provide ammunition for the antis who WILL be watching for the slightest indiscretion on your behalf when they realise that you or others are culling the birds.

Your club must hold a valid licence to cull cormorants, on the licence it will state the number allowed to be culled and it will not be many, it could be as low as 5.
Your reference to a "party" suggests you may not be the only 'legally authorised person' culling the birds?
If the culling is being observed by non members you and whoever else is doing it will need to liase regulary inorder to ensure your Club does not exceed its cull quota. If the quota is exceeded the licence may not be renewed and/or you could find your Club being prosecuted by one of the bird/animal protection societies.

Hope this helps.

Mike, I just have to say that I believe this is one of the most sensible posts I've seen on here. I totally agree with all of the points you raised. An excellent piece of advice In my opinion.

[cookiesdaughtersdad]

Alan, quite frankly, I don't know nor do I care to know what happened to him, but I hope that he was prosecuted and not persecuted as you stated

Persecuted pulling someone up on a typo a typo and autocorrect

Whatever happened to him, there still remains in UK law, a mandatory minimum five years imprisonment for using an unlicensed firearm........

As for the chap I mentioned, saw him the other day, got away with a caution as he knew the law better than the law enforcers

It's of no concern to me if Ben wants to shoot as many cormorants as he likes, using a licensed firearm or not. However, he asked Pit members for advice and as a licenced shotgun holder, having experience of using pneumatic precharged air-rifles and being a past fishing Club Chairman and Secretary involved with dealing with mink and cormorants, I felt somewhat qualified to offer some advice.

Shot a few air rifles myself, a mate is well into it and for some reason I find ballistics and weaponology very interesting, must be the physics that intrigues me but what I do know is how quickly the birds react to the sound and why a faster, quieter round (reference to silencers) would be so beneficial to the task and so worth the extra fuss.

Unlike some people, I do not profess to know everything about everything. I'm like Grant, in that I know a bit about a lot of stuff and a lot about a bit of stuff. Having a Master of Science degree (with Distinction) I've probably forgotten more about science than you've ever googled and spouted out on here as your own knowledge.......

Fair play for the science degree, I'm sure you worked very hard but can you explain its relevance to this ? I wonder how long it will be till you use that again to add weight to your opinion on a non relevant subject?
You have also made the same mistake as others in that I use google far less than you may think and not once for this thread, I may use it to show that something is not just in "my opinion" and I use it to learn more and I have a good memory, sitting here by a keyboard and having the WWW at my fingertips, it would be stooopid not to use it at times!
I never plagiarise others work!

I'm quite sure that, if we were to meet sometime, we would probably get on well, with our common interest in wildlife etc. However, in the time that I've been a member of the Pit, it's been painfully obvious that googled responses form a large part of your posts. Why else do you think you get so much banter about it?
Therefore, I was surprised that you took offence about my bit of banter about you googling something, sufficient to call me a knobhead! Is that really the true spirit of a moderator?

I refer the honorable gentleman to the answer I gave a moment ago!
The only time the banter gets my back up a bit is when someone uses it to "dis" what I have written.... as you did! but the was meant to show the "knob head bit" was still light hearted and a reference to my using google
As for the spirit of the moderators, we will get onto that .

However, I'm thick skinned and I've been called worse that that before, so it's water off a ducks back to me as I'm a firm believer in that if you can't take it you shouldn't dish it out.

Agreed

I also think that all of the points made in Mike J's post above, that you highlighted, were excellently made and full of common sense advice for someone like Ben in his newly appointed role as a Bailiff.

Ben happens to be "the father of the forum" and so owns the feckin thing and so not a newly appointed bailiff at all, when he asked me to help out he made it clear that I should to post as I would want to, if you have a problem with that I suggest you take it up with him.
I think Mikes post as ever was well informed albeit "preachy", Sorry Mike!

The last thing that any of us on here would wish would be to give the anti's any more ammunition (no pun intended) than they already have

I cant find reference to the "party" as Mike put it and angling should stand up for the right to defend our sport.
Personally I think cormorants, mink, otters and even seals are all fascinating creatures but all need to be controlled humanely and I dont hate a single one of them even though I may not like the consequences of their work.
If any common species starts to affect others then I think control is justified, the cormorant issue and their level of protection has been wrong for some time now. In the future the level of protection that otters enjoy will change I'm sure.
I have misgivings about the effectiveness of shooting a few birds, will killing a few when you "get the chance" make much of a difference to cormorant predation when you consider the thousands of birds in the UK?
I regulalrly have cormorants visit our marina and yet it is full of fish.

What I do notice after re reading this thread is that my initial comment totally agree with yours and that I/we, obviously both know the benefits of a faster round and the law concerning them which obviously didnt need to be pointed out to me as you did

Cheers Alan

Here is a question for you Barry, I know a chap who got caught having several guns including shotguns and rifles and many thousands of rounds without a license, he was persecuted and went to crown court, what was his punishment?



Cheers Alan

Meeting you Alan

Andy.

What you again?

(troll face)

[Barryfisher]

Alan, I think you need to re-read Ben's original post in which he stated that he had been recently appointed as a bailiff on his local water. That's got feck all to do with being a bailiff on here!

I'm fully aware that Ben is the father of this forum, ffs I've participated in it enough!

In the same sentence Ben clearly stated that he wanted to "join the party"! Yet you say you can't find any reference to the "party" as Mike put it....

If you haven't grasped the gist of that first sentence of the thread, how the hell do you expect us to take the rest of your posts seriously. Maybe you need to visit Specsavers

The five year mandatory minimum sentence is written in UK law, just try gooling it for a change
I wouldn't fancy anyone else's chances of getting away with a caution as you say your mate did, but feel free to try it for yourself if you fancy your chances.........,

You stated that you "don't know much about using guns" but you then go on to talk about the legal power of an unlicensed firearm and pellet speeds closer to supersonic. Do you really expect us to believe that wasn't straight out of Google?.......In a later post you state that you find weapons and ballistics very interesting?

I did not mention my Masters degree in relation to this post, but if you take the trouble to re-read what I posted, it was to simply reinforce my point that I know a lot about a bit of stuff etc and therefore I don't feel compelled to try to impress all and sundry about my knowledge of everything unlike some people....However, if and when I feel it is relevant I will readily use it again to add weight to my opinion, as I've done professionally for many years. And I haven't actually read any posts that accused you of plagiarism?

Believe it or not Alan, I have absolutely nothing against you personally, as you claim that some others do. In fact I often find some of your responses to be interesting and factual, but I do take exception when someone tries to read something other than what was intended in my posts.

I never intended to "diss" you, the whole point of the bit about you stating the obvious was a piece of p*ss taking and banter; but you seem to have missed that as well....

[Edward.P.A.C]

the whole point of the bit about you stating the obvious was a piece of p*ss taking and banter; but you seem to have missed that as well....

Seems to do that a lot does our googles....
If there was a British record for a t**t , he'd be at the very top.

[Kev Berry]

the whole point of the bit about you stating the obvious was a piece of p*ss taking and banter; but you seem to have missed that as well....

Seems to do that a lot does our googles....
If there was a British record for a t**t , he'd be at the very top.

You're going to take some toppling from that position

[cookiesdaughtersdad]

Alan, I think you need to re-read Ben's original post in which he stated that he had been recently appointed as a bailiff on his local water. That's got feck all to do with being a bailiff on here!
Ah

I'm fully aware that Ben is the father of this forum, ffs I've participated in it enough!
True!


In the same sentence Ben clearly stated that he wanted to "join the party"! Yet you say you can't find any reference to the "party" as Mike put it....

If you haven't grasped the gist of that first sentence of the thread, how the hell do you expect us to take the rest of your posts seriously. Maybe you need to visit Specsavers
I do wear specs but I am dyslexic and missed it, so again

The five year mandatory minimum sentence is written in UK law, just try gooling it for a change
I wouldn't fancy anyone else's chances of getting away with a caution as you say your mate did, but feel free to try it for yourself if you fancy your chances.........,
No thanks but its an interesting case, the chap in question really knows his stuff about British gun law.

You stated that you "don't know much about using guns" but you then go on to talk about the legal power of an unlicensed firearm and pellet speeds closer to supersonic. Do you really expect us to believe that wasn't straight out of Google?.......In a later post you state that you find weapons and ballistics very interesting?
I know about the 12ft/lbs from my mate as we have chatted about them and you can get guns close to twice that I think?
I am interested about them because of the physics and the advantage supersonic speeds and silencers is obvious to this layman.

I did not mention my Masters degree in relation to this post, but if you take the trouble to re-read what I posted, it was to simply reinforce my point that I know a lot about a bit of stuff etc and therefore I don't feel compelled to try to impress all and sundry about my knowledge of everything unlike some people....However, if and when I feel it is relevant I will readily use it again to add weight to my opinion, as I've done professionally for many years. And I haven't actually read any posts that accused you of plagiarism?
I did re read your post, its here,
"Unlike some people, I do not profess to know everything about everything. I'm like Grant, in that I know a bit about a lot of stuff and a lot about a bit of stuff. Having a Master of Science degree (with Distinction) I've probably forgotten more about science than you've ever googled and spouted out on here as your own knowledge......"
You must surely see my point

Believe it or not Alan, I have absolutely nothing against you personally, as you claim that some others do. In fact I often find some of your responses to be interesting and factual, but I do take exception when someone tries to read something other than what was intended in my posts.
Thanks for that I didnt try to re read anything so dont take exception and yes some posters have personal issues with me like the "c0ck" below and a "c0ck" above, nasty little things those trolls!

I never intended to "diss" you, the whole point of the bit about you stating the obvious was a piece of p*ss taking and banter; but you seem to have missed that as well.... :laughs:
I may well have missed the odd point here Barry, but to be honest my back is up a bit but I must say that is not because of you and for you and I to fall out over this would be just plain silly :shake:

Cheers Alan

the whole point of the bit about you stating the obvious was a piece of p*ss taking and banter; but you seem to have missed that as well....

Seems to do that a lot does our googles....
If there was a British record for a t**t , he'd be at the very top.

I think we can all be a t**t at times Eddy and I was so very glad that Dave Horton shared a little nugget of info about you and a certain claimed 39, something you failed to answer properly, heres your chance....mate!

(nasty little troll face)

[Duncan Holmes]

Personally I think cormorants, mink, otters and even seals are all fascinating creatures but all need to be controlled humanely and I dont hate a single one of them even though I may not like the consequences of their work.

f**k me that came round quicker than expected

Why would you put Otters in the same category as the other three, from what we have heard from you over the past few years Otter number are at a sustainable level and will naturally form a balance with our environment.

Now you are suggesting they need to be controlled.

[Edward.P.A.C]

I think we can all be a t**t at times Eddy and I was so very glad that Dave Horton shared a little nugget of info about you and a certain claimed 39, something you failed to answer properly, heres your chance....mate!

(nasty little troll face)

Youre a little late to that particular party googles.....

And because Mr Horton says something its gospel

As I said to your newest BFF just read up and then come back and have a pop.....shouldnt be hard for you. After all you are king of facts and follow up.

[davelumb]

Personally I think cormorants, mink, otters and even seals are all fascinating creatures but all need to be controlled humanely and I dont hate a single one of them even though I may not like the consequences of their work.

f**k me that came round quicker than expected

Why would you put Otters in the same category as the other three, from what we have heard from you over the past few years Otter number are at a sustainable level and will naturally form a balance with our environment.

Now you are suggesting they need to be controlled.

[Duncan Holmes]

Personally I think cormorants, mink, otters and even seals are all fascinating creatures but all need to be controlled humanely and I dont hate a single one of them even though I may not like the consequences of their work.

f**k me that came round quicker than expected

Why would you put Otters in the same category as the other three, from what we have heard from you over the past few years Otter number are at a sustainable level and will naturally form a balance with our environment.

Now you are suggesting they need to be controlled.

Like playing chess, you have to wait for the move to present itself

[Kev Berry]

I think we can all be a t**t at times Eddy and I was so very glad that Dave Horton shared a little nugget of info about you and a certain claimed 39, something you failed to answer properly, heres your chance....mate!

(nasty little troll face)

Youre a little late to that particular party googles.....

And because Mr Horton says something its gospel

As I said to your newest BFF just read up and then come back and have a pop.....shouldnt be hard for you. After all you are king of facts and follow up.

so I have to go out and buy a book to read your fairy tale? no chance Daves version of things is much more interesting , not a very good defence saying read the book is it
so come on then roll it out to those who havnt got "the book", or cant you remember the story

[Andrew]

Bitching over a fish have none of you got f**k all better to do than try and s**t on someones achievment (and behind someones back it appears ?) if yer gonnae be a bitch be a bitch in the open. f****n ridiculous.

[Kev Berry]

Bitching over a fish have none of you got f**k all better to do than try and s**t on someones achievment (and behind someones back it appears ?) if yer gonnae be a bitch be a bitch in the open. f****n ridiculous.

go feck yourself with one of ya toys----it might shut you up for a bit

Jedward is very good at jumping on the bandwagon---just like you -----cant take it then don't try giving it

[Andrew]

Bitching over a fish have none of you got f**k all better to do than try and s**t on someones achievment (and behind someones back it appears ?) if yer gonnae be a bitch be a bitch in the open. f****n ridiculous.

go feck yourself with one of ya toys----it might shut you up for a bit

Jedward is very good at jumping on the bandwagon---just like you -----cant take it then don't try giving it

Hypocrit

[davelumb]

Not squidgers as well Ben next you will be saying magpies

I'm sure Ben only wants to shoot the grey tree rats.

[Duncan Holmes]

Not squidgers as well Ben next you will be saying magpies

I'm sure Ben only wants to shoot the grey tree rats.

Looks like a good excuse for a Wall

[Kev Berry]

Bitching over a fish have none of you got f**k all better to do than try and s**t on someones achievment (and behind someones back it appears ?) if yer gonnae be a bitch be a bitch in the open. f****n ridiculous.

go feck yourself with one of ya toys----it might shut you up for a bit

Jedward is very good at jumping on the bandwagon---just like you -----cant take it then don't try giving it

Hypocrit

who

[Edward.P.A.C]

so I have to go out and buy a book to read your fairy tale? no chance Daves version of things is much more interesting , not a very good defence saying read the book is it
so come on then roll it out to those who havnt got "the book", or cant you remember the story

Of course Daves version is better.........Lies and untruths usually are .

As they say, why let the truth stand in the way of a good story...

Just ask yourself where did Dave get his "facts" from.....ahh yes from book, which he chooses to twist and try and use as a stick to beat me with

See the thing is Kev, Dave and a couple of others seem to think they are taking a pop at me. Nothing could be further from the truth.
As I said if I was in any way ashamed or embarrassed I wouldn't have given the story as I did. I would have done as other tend to like doing.

And lied..